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Is this what the channel has come to? Is a Cisco Catalyst 6500 Supervisor 720 virtual switching supervisor engine with 10 Gigabit Ethernet uplinks really a commodity product? If ever there was a case for over-distribution and the laws of supply and demand taking full effect and taking down a high margin product then it is the case of Cisco products being sold on Amazon.com.

That’s right on Amazon.com. The same place you buy that latest and greatest James Bond DVD or Dan Brown novel you can buy a Cisco Catalyst 6500 Supervisor 720 (“Buy New”) from Amazon seller The Factory Depot for $28,344.33 or what The Factory Depot calls a 25 percent discount of $9,660.67 off the list price of $38,005.00. Or how about a “New” Cisco Catalyst 4948 switch  from TekGalaxy "shipping to a galaxy near you" for  $9,383.31 + $19.45 shipping or $10,272.29 from 7Gifts + $24.45 shipping?

My question for Cisco solution providers - and I do mean SOLUTION PROVIDERS - that have invested heavily in Cisco mandated technical certifications is: how do you feel about your customers being able to go on to Amazon.com and buy these complex products in this kind of public bazaar?

One Cisco partner says the lower than low Amazon listings are a cancer that’s going to eventually backfire on vendors with VARs refusing to do the solutions heavy lifting required to install, support and service these complex products. This Cisco partner believes the Ciscos of the world will eventually either have to do that heavy solutions lifting themselves or find a way for solution providers that have invested heavily in technical certifications to get the margin that is necessary to make sure they can keep customers up and running.

Is there something wrong in a channel world where Cisco switches are available on Amazon.com? What’s the real channel story? And what does Cisco itself have to say about this?

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Jul 7, 2009 2:44 PM PBelyea PBelyea    says:

As a Cisco Silver VAR with multiple specializations this is a critical issue.  It’s true we (true solution providers) invest thousands of dollars on an ongoing basis in training, labs and support.  This online auction mentality relating to unauthorized products devalue the perceived value of the solution we are selling.

 

Ask yourself would you want to buy a cheap ASA to protect your network perimeter but not have access to the frequent software / subscription updates? Customers need to ask the age old question is it too good to be true?

 

If it looks too good to be true ask:

  • Is the person you are purchasing the product from authorized to sell it?  
  • These products are heavily software dependent ... Do you / can you get a legitimate license?
  • Is this a real or counterfeit product? (a growing problem in our industry)
  • Can you get the product on SMARTnet?  Critical to supporting your network core.  (Even if you get it on SMARTnet will Cisco support your unauthorized product when the need for support arises?)

 

The higher end the product, the more risk customers face... We as Solution providers need stress this and Cisco needs to do a better job at educating customers to both the risk and the associated liabilities.  

Jul 7, 2009 5:29 PM Steven Burke Steven Burke    says in response to PBelyea:

The big question here is: why is Cisco taking such a hands off approach to what is obviously a big problem? My contention is vendors like Cisco CHOOSE to look the other way with regard to gray market sales or unauthorized sales of its products.

 

The attitude seems to be "Don't look a Gift Horse in the mouth." CIsco gets the sale and bump in market share. And partners trying to build a viable business around Cisco product get a kick in teeth.

 

I just got off the phone with a Cisco partner who tells me that he often reports such unauthorized sellers to Cisco and it goes into a black hole. There is no follow up whatsoever.

 

Again the question is why does Cisco let this happen? It is up to the Cisco channel leadership team to take a stand here and put some effort into a problem that is CLEARLY affecting the profitability of its best partners.

Jul 8, 2009 1:02 PM MichaelCarioti MichaelCarioti    says:

Hi Steve,

The main problem is that many manufacturers want to control pricing, but not distribution.  My contention has always been that in order to elevate ASP’s, manufacturers MUST close or limit sourcing on the products of concern.  Your Cisco example is a perfect example in that the product is obviously an enterprise level product, but it is treated as an iPod or other commodity product.  Cisco is not the only manufacturer doing this but, again, this is an excellent example.  Our pricing engine is reactive in that we capture market pricing for products and our system raises or lowers our selling price based on the results.  The “Amazon” model simply drives prices down, not to mention that many times they promote refurbished product in the same places that they promote new products, also driving ASP’s down.


Enter the MAP policy.  Manufacturers are terrified of implementing an authorization process that would limit sourcing because they feel it will slow their sales down.  By the same token, they also complain about ASP’s falling to the point that all products are a commodity on the internet.  So, the increased implementation of MAP policies has kept me very busy over the past few years.


Why MAP?  A MAP policy somewhat allows a manufacturer to control advertised price, and also allows them to keep sourcing wide open so MAP offenders may still purchase products from distribution partners.  I know – it is a conflicting comment at best, but it is true.  What’s wrong with MAP policies in general?  They are not enforced by the manufacturers.  We as partners are expected to blow the whistle on our competitors (unwritten rule), and then the manufacturer reacts.  This is a tremendously flawed process which brings us to where we are today.


My solution?  Open sourcing on commodity products is one thing.  But, to have open sourcing on enterprise and business products is absolutely ridiculous.  I would suggest that manufacturers have custom criteria set up for every type of partner (Solution Provider, VAR, DMR, etc.), and the partners that agree to meet the partner requirements would have access to sell the products.  That being said, I don’t believe it would be feasible for a DMR to go through the same training processes as a Solution Provider as we do not install products.  However, there is criteria that we can meet that would separate us from the price hackers of the world, and still limit sourcing to “authorized partners.” 


I just wanted to offer my 2 cents worth to you as it is something I wrestle with every day: React to pricing, or lose market share  - tough choice.


Thanks for listening.  I hope you are doing well.